A question for FK suspension people...

[nismodrifter]

I'm just wondering about one sort of weird (IMO) characteristic that has changed in the suspension/steering after install.

Right after install I noticed a huge deadspot in the steering. When the car was on stock suspension I really liked it because I could take corners using my pinky finger, wobble the wheel just a little bit and it would go BAM turn. There is a HUGE difference between the stock suspension and this one.

With the FK kit installed I can wobble the steering wheel quite a bit at center with little to no movement steering wise. Takes a noticable amount more turning to turn corners and I notice that I always end up taking them reeeal wide.

Then I thought hmm...maybe its because the wheels are wider or something...I didn't ever drive it on stock wheels, the wheels went on during suspension install. After switching to stock Avus the problem is the same...so definately not the wheels. This is like 6 months after.

Another member on vortex (with a TDI....) posted a thread today describing the exact same problem that I am having.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2242064
I have never seen anybody else post about this problem so I thought I was the only one having but it looks like I'm not alone...and he has a TDI too...

Any ideas as to what is going on? Is this normal?

[bart]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

maybe alignment time?

[Khyron]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

I notice a bigger deadzone, but only when the brocks are on. With the 15s mine goes away, so I chalk it up to larger, heavier contact patch. No idea why yours isn't the same - possible something wrong with the power steering?

Khyron

[NeonGTI]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

I have only had one vehicle that has NOT had a wider dead spot after it was lowered and that car (Neon #1) was lowered by a particularly detail oriented tech who made some mods to the control arm to adjust for the excess neg camber that lowering imparts.

God I love that guy. I wish I could find him again.

When I lowered Neon #2 there was a spot about 20 degrees wide on the wheel right dead centre.

You might also notice that at low speeds you seem to take corners really wide but higher speeds it is pretty snappy. It's just a matter of adjustment, unless you want to get the camber fixed.

p.s. I can never get camber and castor straight, so I may have mixed them up.

I'm just wondering about one sort of weird (IMO) characteristic that has changed in the suspension/steering after install.

Right after install I noticed a huge deadspot in the steering. When the car was on stock suspension I really liked it because I could take corners using my pinky finger, wobble the wheel just a little bit and it would go BAM turn. There is a HUGE difference between the stock suspension and this one.

With the FK kit installed I can wobble the steering wheel quite a bit at center with little to no movement steering wise. Takes a noticable amount more turning to turn corners and I notice that I always end up taking them reeeal wide.

Then I thought hmm...maybe its because the wheels are wider or something...I didn't ever drive it on stock wheels, the wheels went on during suspension install. After switching to stock Avus the problem is the same...so definately not the wheels. This is like 6 months after.

Another member on vortex (with a TDI....) posted a thread today describing the exact same problem that I am having.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2242064
I have never seen anybody else post about this problem so I thought I was the only one having but it looks like I'm not alone...and he has a TDI too...

Any ideas as to what is going on? Is this normal?

[VAG_Tech]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

I found a small description of alignment terms. I was too lazy to type it. I love cut and paste!

Toe

Toe, simply put, is direction the wheels are pointing. Zero toe would be perfectly parallel wheels pointing straight forward. Toe-out means the front of the tires are farther apart than the rear of the tires. Toe-in means the front of the tires are closer together than the rear of the tires. Toe has different effects on tire wear in the front and in the rear. When the front wheels are toed out, the inside edge of the tire scuff and wear out early. When the front wheels are toed in, the outside edge will scuff and wear out early. However, on rear tires toe usually causes a diagonal cupping wear pattern whether the tires have too much toe in or too much toe out. The diagonal cups are caused by the tires hopping and skipping along the road. It's hard to explain why, but I'll give it a try. Draw an overview of a car with 4 wheels on a piece of paper, make the front wheels parallel, but toe the rear wheels in substantially (say 45 deg. in just to make the demo easier) Now draw lines parallel with the rear tires following their path of travel if they were to roll. You will notice that the lines you have drawn intersect. Since the tires are attached to the car they can not intersect. Instead they roll a bit, then skid outward, roll a bit, then skid outward again. This goes on and on until the tires have diagonal cups worn into the treads where they have been skidding outward.

Camber

Camber is the lean of the wheel. If the top of the wheel tilted away from the car, that is called positive camber. If the top of the wheel is tilted in towards the car, that is called negative camber. Camber can cause a pull to one side or the other depending on the direction of the lean. The car will pull in the direction of the wheel with the most positive camber. However, if both sides have the same amount of negative or positive camber, they will cancel each other out and the car will not pull. Camber can cause premature tire wear, but is not as hard on tires as toe is.

Caster

Caster is the hardest to explain of the three commonly used alignment angles. I like to use the motorcycle analogy. Lots of positive caster is like the forks on a chopper; the wheel is far in front of the support for the wheel. No car that I know of uses negative camber, so I'll describe less positive camber as like the forks on a regular street bike, the wheel is only slightly in front of the support for the wheel. Caster will not affect tire wear, but it can cause a slight drift if it's not equal on both sides. Caster is an angle that only applies to the front (steering) wheels of a car. The more positive caster is, the more stable the car feels, especially at higher speed. More positive caster also improves steering wheel return. To help understand what steering wheel return is, try this experiment: next time you turn a corner, let go of the steering wheel when you are done turning. You will notice that the steering wheel spins back to the centered position. Without positive caster, the steering wheel would stay turned until you manually turned it back to the center position. The only downside to lots of positive caster is it make the car hard/slow to steer. The reason positive caster adds stability, steering wheel return and increased steering effort is the weight of the car is trying to straighten the wheels. You may notice on some luxury cars with lot of positive caster (and powerful power steering) that the front of the car will rise when the wheel is turned to the side, and sinks as the wheel comes back to center.

[Silverstoned]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

I haven't noticed a dead spot on my car with the 35/40 kit (VR6). Bart has the 55/40 on his TDI and I haven't heard him say anything about a dead spot either. He pushes his car a lot harder than I do, so I'd guess he would notice something like that more than I would. For what it's worth, I'm also running a 28mm Autotech RSB.

Jeff

[Boy Racer]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

Go for very slight toe out. Camber and caster are non issues unless you have camber plates like on my car.

[Boy Racer]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

Oh and bart has HR springs now.. and during the install we noticed the FK shocks were actually crushed and bent where they are clamped by the steering knuckle

[Silverstoned]

Re: A question for FK suspension people...

Oh and bart has HR springs now.. and during the install we noticed the FK shocks were actually crushed and bent where they are clamped by the steering knuckle

Wow, I'll have to take a close look at mine when I put the winter steelies on. Maybe I'll get a chance to upgrade to Bilsteins.