Thinking about a small car

[Tuna]

Ok, thinking about a small car and I want cheap and good on gas. I don't have much brand royalty at this point. Just wondering if some of you have looked into small cars and can help me out.

First I looked at the SMART but they are are a bit on the pricey side even without optioning them (over 20,000), and the new ones are gas which has pro's and cons. No turbo means no bumping up the power with a chip. My other concern is it's suitability to highway driving as I do a lot. There are a few in my area that I see on the highway all the time but never get to ask the owners what they think. The main deterent is the finance rate is HORRIBLE, I think it's the highest of all the Merc's.

Next I looked at a Pontiac Wave (same as suzuki swift). These are cheap! Fully loaded with all power options and all the extra airbags and ABS they come out at a little over 17. GM also gives you a 1000 credit if you take a beater off the road . This car also gets over 40mpg and has 4 doors and some room to spare. It also has 0.0000% interest rate.

Now the above 2 ALSO qualify for a 2000 credit from the government so with some negotiation the wave could be under 15 after tax.

I also priced out a City golf, only problem is these are almost 20,000 with power options, are likely not as fuel efficient as the wave and don't qualify for the 2000 credit (correct me if I'm wrong), so again, cost kind of eliminates it. The interest rate is also much better on than the smart but still not 0.

Should I consider any others? I didn't look at the fit because honda's seem too expensive for what you get (at least in a civic), and I haven't looked at a yaris yet but they were also quite expensive by comparison last I checked.

I've always complained about vw not having a smaller car and I'm tired of waiting, guess I'll have to go elsewhere.

[The_Stig]

Re: Thinking about a small car

Are you only looking for new?

[Tuna]

Re: Thinking about a small car

probably new yes, I plan to drive this a lot and want to just do regular service to it. Plus the SMART salesman made a good point, with some of the SMART's for sale right now they are actually more than a new one due to the 2000 grant.

I actually priced out a Yaris too and with everything I'd need it's just under 18 so that's not bad, interest rate 3.9 though.

[Khyron]

Re: Thinking about a small car

My dad just bought a new sub-compact and I was with him for most of them.

Fit is the best - would be my car in a second if I needed a small city driver. But it's about 900 more (but has the amazing folding seats). 28/34 mpgs.

Nissan Versa is the one he bought with the CVT. I would only get a manual and I couldn't stand the lighting. 26/31

Hyundai Accent hatch was a surprise. It drives as well as the others, but it's not as cheap as you'd think. The versa was 2 or 3 hundred cheaper and at the time the Accent didn't have cruise control. Pretty sure it does now. 27/32

I hate the styling bothing inside and out of the Yaris.

City golf was around the same price as the fit. But it can't compete on the MPGs (21/28). Again, you gotta price them out incl all the extras and look at cost of ownership over 5-10 years.

[The_Stig]

Re: Thinking about a small car

Yeah i would go with a fit also. Iv seen a few with some clean mods and they look nice!

My gf has a honda civic si and she gets like 600km per take with regular fuel. Hondas are amazing on gas if thats what your looking for.

[Tuna]

Re: Thinking about a small car

I just priced out a fit with similar options to the Yaris and the Wave (actually the fit has less) and it comes out to almost 22,000. The interest rate is the same as the yaris though which surprised me.

[Kor]

Re: Thinking about a small car

Think about your depreciation cost. Sure you can buy a Wave for cheaper, but you will be throwing the difference away in 2 or 3 years time. Why not invest a little so that when you sell the car you can afford something nice again next time? Nobody is going to want to buy a used Pontiac Wave.

I like the Yaris myself, and the Hyundai too. The Hyundai is actually pretty cheap, I saw the invoice for one this guy in my office just bought new, he paid $9800 plus tax and dealership fees etc.

I was not impressed with the Fit a the car show.

What about a SCION ?

How much is a Rabbit maybe you can get one thats 1 year old now.

If all you want is cheap and good on gas, I'm not sure why you would only want to buy a new car that is so cheap that it will probably fall apart and depreciate, you should just pick up a late model TDI slightly used or something like that.

[VWSM]

Re: Thinking about a small car

I'm getting rid of my 2007 golf city.
17,000 kms always had synthetic oil changes.
Automatic 2.0l
no sunroof or a/c.
It has p/w, heated seats,alarm system and factory mp3 player.

3 teen boys a hundred pound dog and 2 adults just not enough space.
i just bought a Volvo wagon.
if interested pm me.

[Tuna]

Re: Thinking about a small car

Think about your depreciation cost. Sure you can buy a Wave for cheaper, but you will be throwing the difference away in 2 or 3 years time. Why not invest a little so that when you sell the car you can afford something nice again next time? Nobody is going to want to buy a used Pontiac Wave.

I like the Yaris myself, and the Hyundai too. The Hyundai is actually pretty cheap, I saw the invoice for one this guy in my office just bought new, he paid $9800 plus tax and dealership fees etc.

I was not impressed with the Fit a the car show.

What about a SCION ?

How much is a Rabbit maybe you can get one thats 1 year old now.

If all you want is cheap and good on gas, I'm not sure why you would only want to buy a new car that is so cheap that it will probably fall apart and depreciate, you should just pick up a late model TDI slightly used or something like that.

yes, I'm considering depreciation and I know what the value of a used wave is. But with the intrest rate, same for same I'll be paying an extra 6000 in interest over 5 years for say a yaris over a wave. That's not including the extra I'll pay up front so how much less do you think a 15,000 vs. 20,000 will be worth? That's an extra 10,000 over 5 years. We're not talking about a 40 or 50,000 car here.

I don't think a yaris/fit/wave etc will just "fall apart" in 1 or 2 years even 5, yea maybe it won't be as "refined" and little things might break but with a new car you get warranty for those things. And look how many people payed over 30,000 for a Golf/Jetta only for them to have tons of issues.

And as for TDI's waaaaaaay overpriced right now with usually over 150,000 km's on them and they want the same price as a new sub compact. Also, I'm not paying cash for this no secret, so bank rate is over 8% right now, new car is 0-3% that's another 5000 over and above the cost of the car.

I mean, look at Sunfires, I hate those cars but they could be had for 12-16000 new and there's lots of them still going even after almost 15 years. A co-worker has a 98 with 235,000kms on it and all he's ever done is change the oil.

BTW, thanks Geoff for the input.

Also, this is not my ONLY car, this is something I use to drive back and forth to work, I have more interesting cars for the weekend.

[R_Ethug]

Re: Thinking about a small car

the yaris would be okay.. too bad no polos here

[Tuna]

Re: Thinking about a small car

the yaris would be okay.. too bad no polos here

Yea, well if they had polo's here unless they were way more than all the above we wouldn't have this discussion.

[Kor]

Re: Thinking about a small car

Well, a couple counter points re: depreciation.

Depreciation isn't linear, so if you have seen it going down $1,000 per year for the first couple of years, that is not going to continue. Especially with domestic cars, its more exponential and as it gets older and new models come out it falls even quicker.

My family including me have owned a lot of cheap domestics (2 sunfires, 1 cavalier, 1 grand am) in the last 10 years or so. I don't know who told you they are still going. They actually do just fall apart. 2 engine rebuilds on cars that never made it to 150,000km (both sunfires). Tons of electrical problems, and the interiors fell apart even trying to take care of them. Power windows, locks, radios, heating, air conditioning, all failed. Transmission rebuild on my brother's sunfire coming up (its a 2002). GM has gotten a little better recently, but still. Yeah you see them on the road still. Thats because they sold a million of them so the remaining 20% still seems like a lot. My mom's sunfire was $17,000+ and in 4 years is maybe worth $6,000 now.

I totally understand buying a cheap daily driver thats good on gas - look at my Nissan Sentra. Boring car, but easy to maintain and reliable and decent on gas. Still on warranty and I bought it slightly used and its been great. I wouldn't have the same confidence in a Wave though.

If you are gonna go with a domestic small car, can you find a Pontiac Vibe? Its build on a Toyota.

[R_Ethug]

Re: Thinking about a small car

i'd probably go with a toyota or honda before any american small car.. thats crazy kris!

its funny in a new ford ad they say their quality on on par with toyota now for the fuzion

[Khyron]

Re: Thinking about a small car

i'd probably go with a toyota or honda before any american small car.. thats crazy kris!

its funny in a new ford ad they say their quality on on par with toyota now for the fuzion

They are, for the most part. Toyota is having some pretty serious issues in the last few years. I'd put both Ford and GM above them. And Hyundai is above all 3.

And the Wave is the Aveo which has gotten ok reviews. It's really a Daewoo (Like the chevy epica).

If it's just a transport, and you don't mind the styling/driving then sure why not save 5K and put it towards something a little more fun. But if that's your goal, why not go even further and get a used Civic/Focus/Protege5 for 4-5K and save even more.

[Tuna]

Re: Thinking about a small car

All good points, I guess what I was saying about the depreciation is just that with it being so cheap, even if in 5 years I could only get 5 or 6 grand for it, that's still cheaper over 5 years than buying a car that's 5000 more and I pay 6000 more due to interest.

And I know, a cheap car is a cheap car, but the suzuki reliability has been fairly good, the only thing that is gm on the whole car is basically the grill. They may not quite be up there with the other japanese cars yet but you could do worse.

Anyway, one thing I did see was that the Yaris IS actually cheaper than I though same goes for the fit, I initially ruled them out.

Biggest thing is the cost of purchase, yes I can get a car that's a couple years old and someone else has taken a depreciation hit on it like your sentra but then I take the hit on the interest.